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	<title>Comments for Save Flagler&#039;s Beach</title>
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	<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com</link>
	<description>&#34;...allowing erosion to continue until the seawall becomes the water line.&#34; FDOT report</description>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by Ruth Hellerman,</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1888</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruth Hellerman,</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Nov 2011 18:06:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1888</guid>
		<description>Thanks, to everyone for posting recently.  Everyone is busy these days.  However, it is one thing to know the truth about a subject and another thing to take your time to share your knowledge to help others know the truth. Larry, you are the first person to talk about the river going into the big lake in south Florida. I have a friend who had a rather big cattle ranch down there and he saw.... first hand what the Corps was doing down there.  Now, they are trying somewhat to put it back the way they found it. What a waste of time of taxpayer&#039;s money....not to mention all the negative environmental issues they caused. Can anyone STOP them....or stop Congress from giving them funding and never making them accountable for their disasters??  HELP! Ruth Hellerman</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, to everyone for posting recently.  Everyone is busy these days.  However, it is one thing to know the truth about a subject and another thing to take your time to share your knowledge to help others know the truth. Larry, you are the first person to talk about the river going into the big lake in south Florida. I have a friend who had a rather big cattle ranch down there and he saw&#8230;. first hand what the Corps was doing down there.  Now, they are trying somewhat to put it back the way they found it. What a waste of time of taxpayer&#8217;s money&#8230;.not to mention all the negative environmental issues they caused. Can anyone STOP them&#8230;.or stop Congress from giving them funding and never making them accountable for their disasters??  HELP! Ruth Hellerman</p>
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		<title>Comment on Army Corps of Engineers by Larry Bell</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/army-corps-of-engineers/#comment-1884</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Nov 2011 13:42:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=50#comment-1884</guid>
		<description>The following is just some history of the damage the (USACOE) has done over the years.

The Army Corps incompetence was demonstrated with the Kissimmee River blunder.  Of course years later they spin the story as if they are restoring natural environments.  This story should be mentioned and publicized to show the Corps cannot be trusted.

After the river channel was straightened, 40,000 acres of floodplain below Lake Kissimmee dried out, reducing the quality of waterfowl habitat by ninety percent, and the number of waterfowl by two-thirds. While the Kissimmee was not a significant source of pollution for Lake Okeechobee before channelization, in the 1970s and later the river contributed about 25% of the nitrogen and 20% of the phosphorus flowing into the lake.

After they ruined the Kissimmee river, they now spin their giant screw up with headlines like:
Team restores river basin functions critical to south Florida
Many Corps of Engineers projects in Florida are attempting to restore natural environments, most especially those projects that comprise or relate to the Comprehensive Everglades Restoration Plan. 

The USACOE should be exposed for the damage they have done to Florida.

Thanks,
Larry Bell</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The following is just some history of the damage the (USACOE) has done over the years.</p>
<p>The Army Corps incompetence was demonstrated with the Kissimmee River blunder.  Of course years later they spin the story as if they are restoring natural environments.  This story should be mentioned and publicized to show the Corps cannot be trusted.</p>
<p>After the river channel was straightened, 40,000 acres of floodplain below Lake Kissimmee dried out, reducing the quality of waterfowl habitat by ninety percent, and the number of waterfowl by two-thirds. While the Kissimmee was not a significant source of pollution for Lake Okeechobee before channelization, in the 1970s and later the river contributed about 25% of the nitrogen and 20% of the phosphorus flowing into the lake.</p>
<p>After they ruined the Kissimmee river, they now spin their giant screw up with headlines like:<br />
Team restores river basin functions critical to south Florida<br />
Many Corps of Engineers projects in Florida are attempting to restore natural environments, most especially those projects that comprise or relate to the Comprehensive Everglades Restoration Plan. </p>
<p>The USACOE should be exposed for the damage they have done to Florida.</p>
<p>Thanks,<br />
Larry Bell</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by Jerry Berne</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1877</link>
		<dc:creator>Jerry Berne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Nov 2011 23:41:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1877</guid>
		<description>I have followed coastal environmental issues for over a decade.  In that time, I have discovered only one method which is proven to be successful, environmentally sound and sustainable:  Holmberg Technologies.  This proof includes unversity research, numerous professional monitoring reports and over 30 years of empirical evidence, the most important science test.

Unfortunately, I have heard our very own officials (federal and state), those charged with protecting our coastal resources, literally lie about Holmberg&#039;s success.  This is almost always in efforts to promote traditional engineering processes or the very lucrative dredging programs.  Dredging, having often caused the much of the unnatural erosion now occurring along our shoreline, is then paid again and again to &quot;fix&quot; this manmade environmental problem.  These methods are counterproductive and  beach &quot;nourishment&quot; is really a starvation diet for both our beaches and our public funds.

There is no question that Holmberg&#039;s method&#039;s work.  The physical laws of science being somewhat established for gravity, etc., Holmberg&#039;s reduction of wave/current energies to induce the accretion of indigenous sediment (those which would have naturally be found on that section of coastline) occurs in fresh or salt water, sea-size lakes or Mideastern gulfs or oceans.  The Great Lakes are noted for their hurricane force storms which can last for days not hours as do those in Florida.  Ice floes can literally bulldoze the shoreline removing the beach and dunes.  Yet, Holmberg&#039;s work remains and continues to build the shoreline after decades.

In many way we are losing our coastlines to greed, not erosion.  This can only occur when concerned citizens are kept ignorant of the causes of this erosion and alternatives to prevent it.  Most coastal erosion is now a manmade environmental problem.  As such, we must mitigate it as we would any other manmade environmental problem.  Retreat is not a rational response:  we are losing habitat, not just expensive real estate.  We must, however, employ methods shown to be effective, environmentally sound and sustainable.  To date, Holmbeg remains the only method with any long-term documentation to accomplish this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have followed coastal environmental issues for over a decade.  In that time, I have discovered only one method which is proven to be successful, environmentally sound and sustainable:  Holmberg Technologies.  This proof includes unversity research, numerous professional monitoring reports and over 30 years of empirical evidence, the most important science test.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, I have heard our very own officials (federal and state), those charged with protecting our coastal resources, literally lie about Holmberg&#8217;s success.  This is almost always in efforts to promote traditional engineering processes or the very lucrative dredging programs.  Dredging, having often caused the much of the unnatural erosion now occurring along our shoreline, is then paid again and again to &#8220;fix&#8221; this manmade environmental problem.  These methods are counterproductive and  beach &#8220;nourishment&#8221; is really a starvation diet for both our beaches and our public funds.</p>
<p>There is no question that Holmberg&#8217;s method&#8217;s work.  The physical laws of science being somewhat established for gravity, etc., Holmberg&#8217;s reduction of wave/current energies to induce the accretion of indigenous sediment (those which would have naturally be found on that section of coastline) occurs in fresh or salt water, sea-size lakes or Mideastern gulfs or oceans.  The Great Lakes are noted for their hurricane force storms which can last for days not hours as do those in Florida.  Ice floes can literally bulldoze the shoreline removing the beach and dunes.  Yet, Holmberg&#8217;s work remains and continues to build the shoreline after decades.</p>
<p>In many way we are losing our coastlines to greed, not erosion.  This can only occur when concerned citizens are kept ignorant of the causes of this erosion and alternatives to prevent it.  Most coastal erosion is now a manmade environmental problem.  As such, we must mitigate it as we would any other manmade environmental problem.  Retreat is not a rational response:  we are losing habitat, not just expensive real estate.  We must, however, employ methods shown to be effective, environmentally sound and sustainable.  To date, Holmbeg remains the only method with any long-term documentation to accomplish this.</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by Sherry Epley</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1846</link>
		<dc:creator>Sherry Epley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Nov 2011 01:21:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1846</guid>
		<description>Dear Mary Lou,

I understand what you mean about wanting everything tested and certified successful before trying it ourselves. . . Wow, wouldn&#039;tthat be terrific if life was that way!   BUT,  what progress would have been made in medicine (for example) if everyone refused to be the FIRST patient to save their own lives by trying a new treatment?  We would still be living in the dark ages, in every way, if no one agreed to best the &quot;first&quot; to try a new way to improve the life of human beings on this planet.  Instead of living in fear and expecting failure, what if Holmberg Technologies were successful in rebuilding our dunes, just as they were in multiple sites around stormy lake Michigan and Saudia Arabia?  Why shouldn&#039;t the community of Flagler Beach take a tiny chance and embrace the very real possibility of successful, permanent, environmentally friendly coastal restoration?   

Think of it this way, doing nothing would mean certain death of our entire community. Yet, NO other successful options have been presented.  The Army Corps of Engineers standard methods of attack, armoring (sea walls) and dredging, have proven again and again to not only be failures but undisputable scientific evidence shows those methods actually contribute to increased shoreline erosion.

In my mind, we have everything to gain and nothing to loose by trying the Holmberg system.  If, indeed, you can present a completely successful &quot;tried and true&quot; alternative . . . one that is guaranteed to solve our problem of coastal erosion, we would all be very interested to learn about it.  As I noted before, I am not willing to just let our village be taken by the sea simply because I&#039;m afraid to try something new.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Mary Lou,</p>
<p>I understand what you mean about wanting everything tested and certified successful before trying it ourselves. . . Wow, wouldn&#8217;tthat be terrific if life was that way!   BUT,  what progress would have been made in medicine (for example) if everyone refused to be the FIRST patient to save their own lives by trying a new treatment?  We would still be living in the dark ages, in every way, if no one agreed to best the &#8220;first&#8221; to try a new way to improve the life of human beings on this planet.  Instead of living in fear and expecting failure, what if Holmberg Technologies were successful in rebuilding our dunes, just as they were in multiple sites around stormy lake Michigan and Saudia Arabia?  Why shouldn&#8217;t the community of Flagler Beach take a tiny chance and embrace the very real possibility of successful, permanent, environmentally friendly coastal restoration?   </p>
<p>Think of it this way, doing nothing would mean certain death of our entire community. Yet, NO other successful options have been presented.  The Army Corps of Engineers standard methods of attack, armoring (sea walls) and dredging, have proven again and again to not only be failures but undisputable scientific evidence shows those methods actually contribute to increased shoreline erosion.</p>
<p>In my mind, we have everything to gain and nothing to loose by trying the Holmberg system.  If, indeed, you can present a completely successful &#8220;tried and true&#8221; alternative . . . one that is guaranteed to solve our problem of coastal erosion, we would all be very interested to learn about it.  As I noted before, I am not willing to just let our village be taken by the sea simply because I&#8217;m afraid to try something new.</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by The Wave Whisperer</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1845</link>
		<dc:creator>The Wave Whisperer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Nov 2011 21:39:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1845</guid>
		<description>First, there are VERY big waves on Lake Michigan, Marylou. VERY big. In winter, they are ICE WAVES. Plus they are fresh water waves, which means they are less buoyant and therefore can carry less sand than ocean waves. And don&#039;t sell the Arabian Gulf short, either. There are extremely powerful currents and waves there.

Second, a kind of &#039;test&#039; is what we&#039;re asking for. Not a whole Flagler County shoreline, but a one-mile demonstration, so it can be shown that Undercurrent Stabilizers truly perform as advertised. After all, what&#039;s the alternative? More sea walls? More dredging? Moving A1A and abandoning Flagler Beach (which you suggested)? A few million dollars is pockjet change in the scheme of things--especially since MORE than a few million is being spent on the Army Corps of Engineers&#039; &quot;study,&quot; which produces nothing but nice incomes for a bunch of 9-to-5ers and will do zilch to expand or even protect our beach. Good luck getting any of THAT back!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First, there are VERY big waves on Lake Michigan, Marylou. VERY big. In winter, they are ICE WAVES. Plus they are fresh water waves, which means they are less buoyant and therefore can carry less sand than ocean waves. And don&#8217;t sell the Arabian Gulf short, either. There are extremely powerful currents and waves there.</p>
<p>Second, a kind of &#8216;test&#8217; is what we&#8217;re asking for. Not a whole Flagler County shoreline, but a one-mile demonstration, so it can be shown that Undercurrent Stabilizers truly perform as advertised. After all, what&#8217;s the alternative? More sea walls? More dredging? Moving A1A and abandoning Flagler Beach (which you suggested)? A few million dollars is pockjet change in the scheme of things&#8211;especially since MORE than a few million is being spent on the Army Corps of Engineers&#8217; &#8220;study,&#8221; which produces nothing but nice incomes for a bunch of 9-to-5ers and will do zilch to expand or even protect our beach. Good luck getting any of THAT back!</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by webmaster</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1843</link>
		<dc:creator>webmaster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Nov 2011 20:27:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1843</guid>
		<description>Do you work for the Army Corps of Engineers or the FL Dept of Transport Marylou? Your questions and the way they are asked sound like those we have heard before from some who do not want anything but dredging and dumping sand.

If you read our website you will find before and after pictures of an ocean installation of Undercurrent Stabilizers. The results were amazing! What more do you want?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you work for the Army Corps of Engineers or the FL Dept of Transport Marylou? Your questions and the way they are asked sound like those we have heard before from some who do not want anything but dredging and dumping sand.</p>
<p>If you read our website you will find before and after pictures of an ocean installation of Undercurrent Stabilizers. The results were amazing! What more do you want?</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by marylou</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1833</link>
		<dc:creator>marylou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Nov 2011 17:18:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1833</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d feel alot better if the undercurrent stabilizers were tested in an ocean and not gulfs and lakes.  I&#039;m not feeling the confidence that you are feeling especially without ocean testing over a long period of recent history.  Sorry, we can&#039;t afford to lose on this one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d feel alot better if the undercurrent stabilizers were tested in an ocean and not gulfs and lakes.  I&#8217;m not feeling the confidence that you are feeling especially without ocean testing over a long period of recent history.  Sorry, we can&#8217;t afford to lose on this one.</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by The Wave Whisperer</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1831</link>
		<dc:creator>The Wave Whisperer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Nov 2011 13:55:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1831</guid>
		<description>Yes, the Wave Whisperer has neighbors who have lived in town for a long time, too. They were avid surfers, and say they remember when there was a whole beautiful dune system leading down to a wonderful broad beach. And the ocean WANTS to continue building the beach--but the big holes and trenches the dredging has created under the water won&#039;t let it. So don&#039;t blame the ocean! 

As to getting our money back, think about it: When sea walls, breakwaters, dredging, etc. don&#039;t do any good, do you ever hear a cry to get our money back? All the methods take huge amounts of money, and none has ever worked. At least Undercurrent Stabilizers have a track record of success--and they cost a fraction of the other methods. But don&#039;t worry. Once they&#039;re in, they&#039;ll work. And they&#039;ll continue working. Not only will you be able to stand on your dune walkover, you&#039;ll probably need to extend it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, the Wave Whisperer has neighbors who have lived in town for a long time, too. They were avid surfers, and say they remember when there was a whole beautiful dune system leading down to a wonderful broad beach. And the ocean WANTS to continue building the beach&#8211;but the big holes and trenches the dredging has created under the water won&#8217;t let it. So don&#8217;t blame the ocean! </p>
<p>As to getting our money back, think about it: When sea walls, breakwaters, dredging, etc. don&#8217;t do any good, do you ever hear a cry to get our money back? All the methods take huge amounts of money, and none has ever worked. At least Undercurrent Stabilizers have a track record of success&#8211;and they cost a fraction of the other methods. But don&#8217;t worry. Once they&#8217;re in, they&#8217;ll work. And they&#8217;ll continue working. Not only will you be able to stand on your dune walkover, you&#8217;ll probably need to extend it!</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by marylou</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1802</link>
		<dc:creator>marylou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Nov 2011 16:52:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1802</guid>
		<description>Actually I live 2 blocks from the ocean, and I&#039;ve been watching the dunes dissappear for 40 years now with the promise that the beach would renourish itself...just not happening anymore.  We used to drive up and down the beaches of Flagler, can&#039;t even hardly stand on the dunewalkovers during high tide with the waves crashing on the dune walkovers.  Whether it&#039;s from man or nature, it doesn&#039;t matter, the ocean is trying to take A1A in spite of all efforts to save it.  Just saying.  Can we get our money back if the underwater stabilizers don&#039;t work?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually I live 2 blocks from the ocean, and I&#8217;ve been watching the dunes dissappear for 40 years now with the promise that the beach would renourish itself&#8230;just not happening anymore.  We used to drive up and down the beaches of Flagler, can&#8217;t even hardly stand on the dunewalkovers during high tide with the waves crashing on the dune walkovers.  Whether it&#8217;s from man or nature, it doesn&#8217;t matter, the ocean is trying to take A1A in spite of all efforts to save it.  Just saying.  Can we get our money back if the underwater stabilizers don&#8217;t work?</p>
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		<title>Comment on How to Save Flagler&#8217;s Beaches by Sherry Epley</title>
		<link>http://saveflaglersbeach.com/how-to-save-flaglers-beaches/#comment-1790</link>
		<dc:creator>Sherry Epley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Nov 2011 01:14:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saveflaglersbeach.com/?page_id=780#comment-1790</guid>
		<description>Dear Mary Lou,

You may have had the best of intentions by your suggestion of moving A1A to Old King&#039;s road.  BUT, please, think this through and realize that such a solution would result in the complete death of the village of Flagler Beach.  All the seaside small/family owned shops, motels and restaurants would be put out of business. . . in favor of yet another strip center along Old King&#039;s road filled with the same old chain enterprises.  Flagler Beach is unique in that it is one of the last small beach towns left in Florida.  Many others have been dredged, bulldozed, destroyed (&quot;redeveloped&quot;) and what remains are souless high rises and shops/restaurants only the rich and famous can afford. Again, the middle class squeezed out!

In addition, the exisiting roadbed for A1A would still need to be kept structurally sound so that the few remaining residents (the ones that couldn&#039;t sell after the town dissappeared) could access their homes.  So the problem of supporting that highway would not be solved anyway.

It would be interesting to know where you currently reside. . . different perspectives may come into play here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Mary Lou,</p>
<p>You may have had the best of intentions by your suggestion of moving A1A to Old King&#8217;s road.  BUT, please, think this through and realize that such a solution would result in the complete death of the village of Flagler Beach.  All the seaside small/family owned shops, motels and restaurants would be put out of business. . . in favor of yet another strip center along Old King&#8217;s road filled with the same old chain enterprises.  Flagler Beach is unique in that it is one of the last small beach towns left in Florida.  Many others have been dredged, bulldozed, destroyed (&#8220;redeveloped&#8221;) and what remains are souless high rises and shops/restaurants only the rich and famous can afford. Again, the middle class squeezed out!</p>
<p>In addition, the exisiting roadbed for A1A would still need to be kept structurally sound so that the few remaining residents (the ones that couldn&#8217;t sell after the town dissappeared) could access their homes.  So the problem of supporting that highway would not be solved anyway.</p>
<p>It would be interesting to know where you currently reside. . . different perspectives may come into play here.</p>
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